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gundamgarrett
the Schleprock of sex

Registered: Oct 2012
Location:
Posts: 1387

quote:
Originally posted by Sookee
*sarcasm tags*I wish I was as compassionate towards murderers as you guys. I'd rather not house,feed,provide medical care,a gym,cable TV, books, visits with family so and and so forth with humans that have been found without a reasonable doubt guilty for said crime(s).



That being said,I respect your opinion,even if I disagree,wholeheartedly.



Compassionate? How on earth is not wanting decent people to lower themselves to the level of murders, being compassionate to the killer?

I want to see them in prison for the rest of their lives. Prison is not as fun as you just made it sound. Even with comforts it is still prison, you still don't ever get to leave. Never get to raise children, or go fishing, or hiking, never get to spend another thanksgiving with your family eating a nice meal and enjoying the love of those closest to you.

And it costs more to execute someone than it does, to keep them in prison for the rest of their lives.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 03:33 AM
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Sookee
good luck with that.

Registered: Mar 2007
Location:
Posts: 7179

quote:
Originally posted by gundamgarrett
Compassionate? How on earth is not wanting decent people to lower themselves to the level of murders, being compassionate to the killer?

I want to see them in prison for the rest of their lives. Prison is not as fun as you just made it sound. Even with comforts it is still prison, you still don't ever get to leave. Never get to raise children, or go fishing, or hiking, never get to spend another thanksgiving with your family eating a nice meal and enjoying the love of those closest to you.

And it costs more to execute someone than it does, to keep them in prison for the rest of their lives.




I have a career criminal,addict brother in prison. I know exactly how fun it is for him. He has absolutely no responsibility there and that is what he prefers. He knows no other life.He doesn't care about his children (that I myself have taken in) or any holiday. Hard core criminals don't give two shits. Why should I? I'm a decent person. I abide by the law.

A single bullet costs about 1.50 x that by a firing squad of 5 .. pretty cheap in my estimation.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 03:57 AM
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SimpleSimon
Dead Horse Rider

Registered: Dec 2002
Location:
Posts: 28687

In all honesty, your last line above, gg, is false. The execution costs peanuts. What costs is the appeals process.

We have the technology available today to ascertain beyond any doubt at all, if a person is in fact guilty of an offense. Yes, we have a Constitution which prohibits compelling a person to testify against themselves, and that is a good thing. However, once duly convicted in a court of law beyond a reasonable doubt of an offense, we could quite readily then compel those so convicted to submit to such examination. While it would be difficult to limit that compelled evidence to the instant offense for which the convicted person was convicted, it is not procedurally difficult to so limit the applicability of any such evidence to only that instant offense.

Convict them in a jury trial (no plea bargains allowed), then examine them with the tools available. If that examination exonerates them (statistically, it will do so for a percentage of those convicted), then void the conviction, seal the record of all evidence gathered by the examination in such a way as to prohibit its use in subsequent proceedings of any kind (civil or criminal), and release them with a clean record. If they are further shown to have committed the offense, no pardons, no paroles.

The criminal justice system in this country is one of the fastest growing industries extant, and it the path to power for a great many wanna-be control freaks. Which is why what I suggest above has zero chance of ever happening.

Last edited by SimpleSimon on 01-22-2014 at 04:14 AM

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:10 AM
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Large Filipino
Fuck me hard in my arse.

Registered: Feb 2004
Location: in colorado somewhere!
Posts: 53109

quote:
Originally posted by gundamgarrett
There are old west towns all over America that serve as museums to the times of cowboys and train robbers. Visit one sometime. Back then public executions were the order of the day, and so was murder.

The death penalty is not an effective deterrent.

"torn apart by tigers", Sensationalizing the death of an "evildoer", is in it self an evil act.

I would not want to see America or any country use Rome as a model for "Justice", we are supposed to progress, not devolve, as time goes on and we learn lessons.



Have you watched a UFC fight lately?
I was raised at a time where the cage match for WWF was the big shit.
And any blood lost was horrific.

Now the cage match is a requirement.
And blood loss does not stop a fight.
AND THEY ARE NOT FAKING IT.
We see people breaking their fucking arms in that shit.
And people watch.

As much as we hate to admit it,
It's coming.

People already screaming the second amendment on gun rights.
People wanting our world to go back to the wild wild west where guns are not regulated and you settle a score with a bullet.

Our world is going backwards because we have become too stupid to learn from history.

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I would throw it in a Orangutan enclosure
And watch the orgy.

Last edited by Large Filipino on 01-22-2014 at 04:27 AM

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:23 AM
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Trenchant_Troll
ad hominid

Registered: Mar 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 44516

I think the guy should have had a rototiller tear out his entrails. Come to think of it, I think that about everyone.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:37 AM
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gundamgarrett
the Schleprock of sex

Registered: Oct 2012
Location:
Posts: 1387

quote:
Originally posted by SimpleSimon
In all honesty, your last line above, gg, is false. The execution costs peanuts. What costs is the appeals process.




your correct but the appeals cost is part of the cost of the execution. you can't take away the right to appeal. Well, actually, if we are gonna be murders what the fuck do we care if we accidentally fry a couple of innocent people in the pursuit of "Justice", in fact I propose a new way of training cops, we will call it the Zimmerman theory, if a poor minority looks guilty just kill him, it will save money and teach other minorities not to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:58 AM
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gundamgarrett
the Schleprock of sex

Registered: Oct 2012
Location:
Posts: 1387

quote:
Originally posted by Sookee
I have a career criminal,addict brother in prison. I know exactly how fun it is for him. He has absolutely no responsibility there and that is what he prefers. He knows no other life.He doesn't care about his children (that I myself have taken in) or any holiday. Hard core criminals don't give two shits. Why should I? I'm a decent person. I abide by the law.

A single bullet costs about 1.50 x that by a firing squad of 5 .. pretty cheap in my estimation.



Your right, one prick enjoys prison, so we should lower ourselves to the level of common 5 year olds, "He broke my toy, you should break his toy".

Shit, why go through the trouble of hiring a firing squad and buying 5 bullets, I have a rusty pocket knife, I will give the criminal justice system for free. Anything to help in the pursuit of justice.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 05:03 AM
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Sookee
good luck with that.

Registered: Mar 2007
Location:
Posts: 7179

*shakes head*

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Old Post 01-22-2014 05:03 AM
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mattdk
, Architect Of Thought

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: The Midwest
Posts: 2276

quote:
Originally posted by Sookee
I have a career criminal,addict brother in prison. I know exactly how fun it is for him. He has absolutely no responsibility there and that is what he prefers. He knows no other life.He doesn't care about his children (that I myself have taken in) or any holiday. Hard core criminals don't give two shits. Why should I? I'm a decent person. I abide by the law.



It isn't good enough that he's separated from the rest of you "decent" people and you don't have to consider him ever again?

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Old Post 01-22-2014 05:29 AM
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Pinecrika
Muffer's He-beast

Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Aotearoa
Posts: 19810

quote:
Originally posted by Sookee
I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who felt that way. I wish they'd just use a firing squad instead of lethal injection.Seems to me,it'd be a hell of a lot cheaper than the drugs.


Sure you're not from Idaho?

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Old Post 01-22-2014 06:44 AM
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Mister Freign
Population Surplus

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: Happytown
Posts: 7860

quote:
Originally posted by Trenchant_Troll
I think the guy should have had a rototiller tear out his entrails. Come to think of it, I think that about everyone.


I've got a log jam of hilarious medical themed responses to this, all backed up in my typey finger

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Old Post 01-22-2014 08:25 AM
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Coincidence
Counterfeit

Registered: Apr 2004
Location: Sun
Posts: 33004

If only humanity had some kind of history with crime and punishment, then we could set aside our emotions and learn from that.

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You're in the wrnght place.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 10:55 AM
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Dacarlo
ex-member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location:
Posts: 15481

The real crime here aside from raping and killing an 8 month pregnant woman, is allowing him to survive so long after the fact costing how much to keep alive?

Firing squad with one soldier carrying the live round so they don't know which did the deed. Cost charged to the estate of the criminal.

Even cheaper, and used in the UK till it was abolished. Very effective, fast, cost effective.



All this dilly dallying is cruel on the family of the criminal. Frankly I wouldn't have even turned up to see that since I don't fancy scarring myself for life.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 11:01 AM
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Mister Freign
Population Surplus

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: Happytown
Posts: 7860

srsly! boooohoohoo the murdering rapist took 15 minutes to die, booooo hoo, the terror of it all.

despite my compassionate leanings, I'm not a big fan of extending human warmth to rapists. toss in a pregnant lady and my question becomes "can we pay to hit him with a mallet while he's waiting for the shot, sort of like a junk car at the state fair"

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Old Post 01-22-2014 11:13 AM
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Coincidence
Counterfeit

Registered: Apr 2004
Location: Sun
Posts: 33004

The problem must surely be 'how do we most effectively stop rape from happening'? Not 'how can we satisfy our blood lust most satisfyingly'.

But I could be wrong.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 11:55 AM
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Mister Freign
Population Surplus

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: Happytown
Posts: 7860

I was about to launch into this thing about how I agitated for the abolition of the death penalty, worked with and even could be said to have "rehabilitated" more than one convicted rapist and murderer, but it obscures the facts: I'm a bloodthirsty ape that doesn't turn away from the opportunity to mete out ugly reprisals in some cases - part of why I rock the apple/orange icon on so many sites -

both of these things can exist in one place, but it requires a painful adaptation as well as the willingness to expose oneself to ruthless self-exam.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 12:01 PM
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Coincidence
Counterfeit

Registered: Apr 2004
Location: Sun
Posts: 33004

So you're both pro and anti-rape. That's just called confusion.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 12:07 PM
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Mister Freign
Population Surplus

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: Happytown
Posts: 7860

Unfortunately I am often unable to be humorous about that specific subject. No; I am not pro-rape. If I seem confused, it is probably because you assume zero-sum a/o dilemma are necessary states of mind. You'll find me consistent, I imagine, if you decide to make a study of it.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 03:51 PM
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Dacarlo
ex-member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location:
Posts: 15481

Can't duplicitous thoughts exist? We might feel compassion for another living thing even though we demand or sanction their death. Something the victims family more or less demonstrated with their forgiveness, followed by the 'He must pay' line. I wonder if they're Christians (insert cheek turning jokes here).

From a dispassionate point of view, if we're to support TDP it should be cheap painless and dealt swiftly. 25 years on death row could amount to mental torture in itself for all parties involved no? Not to mention the massive costs involved incarcerating the villain which further damages society.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 03:54 PM
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mattdk
, Architect Of Thought

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: The Midwest
Posts: 2276

quote:
Originally posted by Coincidence
The problem must surely be 'how do we most effectively stop rape from happening'? Not 'how can we satisfy our blood lust most satisfyingly'.

But I could be wrong.



Yeah this

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Old Post 01-22-2014 03:56 PM
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SimpleSimon
Dead Horse Rider

Registered: Dec 2002
Location:
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Modify the basic nature of humanity. Otherwise, at best you will lower the incidence a bit.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:09 PM
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Dacarlo
ex-member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location:
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quote:
Originally posted by mattdk
Yeah this


Since rape is most often perpetrated by men on women, perhaps there needs to be a conversation with kids at the sex ed stage that addresses this. Mutual respect and myth busting would probably help.

Positive, rather than negative male role models would be another good move.

Think about men in media and how they're portrayed.

This guys argument starts off reasonably, but he lacks panache, and his conclusions aren't going to produce the role models we're after, just more clowns.

http://uk.askmen.com/daily/austin_6...hion_style.html

Rather than asking traditionally sensitive groups to take themselves less seriously, we could -shock- take ourselves more seriously?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/meghanc...representation/

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Old Post 01-22-2014 04:30 PM
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Coincidence
Counterfeit

Registered: Apr 2004
Location: Sun
Posts: 33004



It seems to be centered around the equator.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 06:54 PM
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magnolia
playground monitor

Registered: May 2008
Location:
Posts: 5536

quote:
Originally posted by Dacarlo
Can't duplicitous thoughts exist? We might feel compassion for another living thing even though we demand or sanction their death. Something the victims family more or less demonstrated with their forgiveness, followed by the 'He must pay' line. I wonder if they're Christians (insert cheek turning jokes here).
...

in some cases, turning the other cheek might be considered not agitating for an eye for an eye - in other words, not screaming that the perp be raped and slashed himself but allowed to spend time saying goodbye to his family and then drifting off to sleep as opposed to an arbitrary end filled with confusion, panic, fear and pain with no chance to say "i love you" one last time.

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Old Post 01-22-2014 11:32 PM
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gundamgarrett
the Schleprock of sex

Registered: Oct 2012
Location:
Posts: 1387

What's the point? honestly, someone tell me because i just don't get it. What good is actually done by executing someone?

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