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magnolia
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civil liberties:

is this an invasion of privacy or a legitimate tool to prosecute those who have sex with girls under the age of consent?

one of the interesting questions is that the aclu is claiming it violates the privacy of the mother, father and the child. the mother and father have a vested interest in not revealing the information. since the data must be collected at the time of birth, is it unreasonable to say that the child has a right to know who his/her father is - and even though unable to give consent at the time of birth, that the data should be preserved so that the child can know? for medical reasons if nothing else?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 03:58 PM
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Rokkr
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Perhaps if they allowed students to learn about contraception versus abstinence (which has worked so well) they'd have less births and wouldn't be the leader in young adults who are HIV positive.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/..._n_1719882.html

As is pointed out so often of late, there's a reason hardcore conservative states are generally the poorest and worst educated in the US.

People are worried so much about their guns being taken, but highly personal things like DNA get short shrift.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 04:10 PM
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magnolia
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those are different discussions.

on this particular point, what gets precedence?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 04:21 PM
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Rokkr
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Ok, how's this? Live in a state run by knobheads and you get what you deserve.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 05:07 PM
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magnolia
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you really can't bring yourself to discuss the issue, can you? pfft.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 05:08 PM
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rust
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quote:
Originally posted by Rokkr
As is pointed out so often of late, there's a reason hardcore conservative states are generally the poorest and worst educated in the US.

People are worried so much about their guns being taken, but highly personal things like DNA get short shrift.



Don't be a cunt.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 05:10 PM
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magnolia
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rokkr, it's not as though a lot of 10 to 16 year olds have a lot of say in where they live. they are legally children. to which rights are they - and newborns - entitled?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 05:14 PM
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billgerat
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quote:
Originally posted by magnolia
rokkr, it's not as though a lot of 10 to 16 year olds have a lot of say in where they live. they are legally children. to which rights are they - and newborns - entitled?


They are entitled to the same rights everyone else is. Hell, make the law say that every mother, adult and juvenile, have to supply it. Then sit back and wait for the furor to develop. Or not, since it was those knobheads who voted the conservative knobheads into power in the first place.

Like Rokkr said, you get what you pay for.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 06:51 PM
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creepy uncle
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“It is to stop children from being raped,” said Bryant, who started his career as a deputy sheriff in the 1970s.

Hasn't the horse already bolted?

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quote:
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My anus is bleeding.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:00 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by billgerat
They are entitled to the same rights everyone else is. Hell, make the law say that every mother, adult and juvenile, have to supply it. Then sit back and wait for the furor to develop. Or not, since it was those knobheads who voted the conservative knobheads into power in the first place.

Like Rokkr said, you get what you pay for.

interesting that you live in a state that allows 10 to 16 year olds to vote.

dumbass.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:26 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by creepy uncle
“It is to stop children from being raped,” said Bryant, who started his career as a deputy sheriff in the 1970s.

Hasn't the horse already bolted?

for these children, yes.

but research shows that a huge number of minors are impregnated by adults. if i had to guess, they're thinking that it might deter some in the future. the question is, is it worth the loss of privacy? is there even a question that minors are entitled to privacy?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:29 PM
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Rokkr
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quote:
Originally posted by rust
Don't be a cunt.

Hahahaha, this from someone who does nothing but troll.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:31 PM
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Rokkr
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And of course I'm firmly against anything so invasive. I pretty much said that in my original post.
But perhaps my remark about DNA you found cryptic. The point was so many wet their panties worrying about their guns being taken away, but say nothing about their even more important personal rights, such as not ending up in law enforcement databases.

While I don't advocate sex with minors, I suspect the majority of fathers in the cases they seem worried about are likely to be minors too.

So we go back to my initial point which was to avoid these situations entirely by offering better education.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:36 PM
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rust
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quote:
Originally posted by Rokkr
Hahahaha, this from someone who does nothing but troll.


I'm sure I have no idea what you're talking about.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:42 PM
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magnolia
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this report is 15 years old, based on data that's even older. i was working in abuse investigations when it came out.

http://www.americanbar.org/content/...uthcheckdam.pdf

"This project began amid a climate of federal welfare reform deliberations, and we hoped
our work could help stop the demonizing of teen mothers who receive public assistance by promoting awareness that adult men,
not teenage boys, are often responsible for impregnating most young teen girls. No longer should these men be invisible parties in policy considerations. Governors, legislatures, and those who enforce the laws would be reminded that men who are older and more experienced are controlling and manipulating young teen girls for sex. "

in one study cited, 40% of the pregnant 15 year olds studied had partners 5+ years older. while not a majority, it's clearly a very significant amount. so the question isn't only about the pregnancies and how to avoid them, it's also what do we as a society do to break that particular chain whether it results in pregnancy or not.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:54 PM
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Rokkr
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And again, education is a better answer than more laws.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 07:59 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by Rokkr
And of course I'm firmly against anything so invasive. I pretty much said that in my original post.
But perhaps my remark about DNA you found cryptic. The point was so many wet their panties worrying about their guns being taken away, but say nothing about their even more important personal rights, such as not ending up in law enforcement databases.

i understood the remark to mean that having one's dna on a database was a more pressing concern than having one's gun taken away, and you may be right about that, but did not presume to extrapolate that view to an actual answer as to whether the practice of dna identification of unnamed fathers by secretive mothers should never be allowed, should sometimes be allowed are should always be allowed.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:00 PM
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billgerat
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quote:
Originally posted by magnolia
interesting that you live in a state that allows 10 to 16 year olds to vote.

dumbass.



?????

I think you inhaled that hit too deeply.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:01 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by Rokkr
And again, education is a better answer than more laws.
and you see education as solving the problem entirely?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:01 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by billgerat
?????

I think you inhaled that hit too deeply.

10 to 16 year olds had no part in voting whatever knobhead is in power, to power. so explain to me how they "got what they paid for".

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:03 PM
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Rokkr
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quote:
Originally posted by magnolia
and you see education as solving the problem entirely?

Nothing in the realm of reality would ever solve the problem entirely. I'm surprised you would even ask that question, as you likely already know this.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:09 PM
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ignatz mouse
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I'm going to go with invasion of privacy. This is Mississippi we're talking about, after all.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:14 PM
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magnolia
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mousie, as a therapist, if one of those girls tells you the identity of an overage father, you're obliged to report it, yes?

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:16 PM
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magnolia
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quote:
Originally posted by Rokkr
Nothing in the realm of reality would ever solve the problem entirely. I'm surprised you would even ask that question, as you likely already know this.
of course i know that. so what i'm getting is that using this tool to identify (potentially) pedophiles is not worth the erosion of any perceived civil right.

ok, got it.

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Old Post 08-02-2013 08:19 PM
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ignatz mouse
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quote:
Originally posted by magnolia
mousie, as a therapist, if one of those girls tells you the identity of an overage father, you're obliged to report it, yes?


Absolutely. But, I work with her to report it herself, first. AND I'm not taking her cord blood and typing it without her permission. When I work with anyone, I tell them I'm a mandatory reporter first. Then it's on them what they tell me.

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